Interview with Alta (Rowley) Perkins Wilcock

Alta (Rowley) Perkins Wilcock was interviewed on October 15, 1968 in St. George, Washington County, Utah by Fielding H. Harris, a representative of the Voices of Remembrance Foundation. She related her personal history of living in various parts of Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, Idaho, and Utah.

FH:Would you please give your full name?

AW:Alta (Rowley) Wilcock.

FH:[What is] your birth date?

AW:[I was born] October 28, 1900.

FH:[Where were] you born?

AW:Colonia Diaz, Chihuahua, Mexico.

FH:[What was] your father's name?

AW:John Sylvester Rowley.

FH:[What was] your mother's [full] name?

AW:Eliza Clemmons [Rowley].

FH:Will you tell us some of the early recollections from you childhood, maybe what you can remember from your earliest [recollection]?

AW:I can remember when we lived in [Colonia] Diaz, before we moved out to the 00:01:00ranch; my little sister, Beulah, was born. [She] lived only ten days and died. That was the first death that I [can] remember. Not long after that, dad bought a ranch or a farm, and we moved out to the farm.

FH:Was that near [Colonia] Diaz?

AW:[Yes, and] I lived there until the war with Mexico.

FH:Was the death of your sister quite a common problem [at that] time because of the lack of hospitals and [medical] facilities?

AW:I guess it was.

FH:Tell a little more about [the] farm that your father bought [and the] living conditions.

AW:It was a two-room adobe house. Dad raised corn, wheat, and a vegetable garden. On the side, he did a lot of freighting in Mexico for years and years. That was the way he made his living. [Inaudible] he had. He had cows, chickens, and horses. He was a great lover of horses. [He was] one of the greatest horsemen that there ever was.

FH:[Did] you have to do a lot of work around the place when you were growing up?

AW:I [wasn't] old enough to do too much, but we all did our share as we grew up. My older brother and sister had to do a lot of work around the place.

FH:Was this irrigated farming?

AW:Yes. [There was] a big spring up above where we lived. It came up out of the ground [and was] big enough [that] we used it for a swimming pool. [The] whole town would go out there on vacations [or] holidays and use it for a swimming pool. A big stream, a regular canal, ran down through the town [and] that [was] used for irrigation.

FH:[Did] your schooling commence here?

AW:Yes.

FH:How old were you when you [moved] from [Colonia] Diaz to the farm? Do you remember? Had you started school [by] then?

AW:I [started] school soon after that; I don't remember [just when]. I [do] remember walking from the farm to town to school.

FH:Was it very far?

AW:No, it wasn't too far, about a mile. There were cottonwood trees along the lane into town. The main street in town had cottonwood trees growing along both 00:04:00sides [that] met in the middle, just like an arbor, through the center of town.

FH:I would have liked to have seen this.

AW:It was a beautiful town, it really was.

FH:Did you have some brothers and sister near your age?

AW:Yes, I had two sisters. One was about eighteen months younger than me [and the] other one that was eighteen months younger than [her]. We played [with] rag dolls and stick dolls all the time. [We] never had a real doll until we [moved] out of Mexico. [We] used to make our dolls out of rags.

FH:[Did you] have to be self-sustaining down there?

AW:Yes.

FH:How much [education] were you able to get?

AW:I went as far as [the] eighth grade. I have the certificate [from my graduation] from the eighth grade. [This school] was in Blanding [San Juan County, Utah] after we [moved] out of Mexico.

FH:Was this a school where all the grades met together and [the] teachers taught several grades at once?

AW:Yes, in [Colonia] Diaz it was when I was down there.

FH:What do you remember about your teachers?

AW:I don't remember much about [my teachers] in Mexico. There were other things I was more interested in. [Laughter] I remember the trouble they were having with the Mexicans all the time. I remember one time we were coming home from 00:06:00school and someone said the rebels were coming. We got under a bridge [over] the ditch and they ran over the top of us. We [could] hear the clatter of the horses going over the top!

They used to come into town and pick out the best horses and take them. Dad had lots of good horses and he always took good care of them. He had one that was special to him. [There was] an old lime kiln that [was] used to burn lime in and he took his horse down there and threw hay over him to hide [the horse] from the Mexicans so they wouldn't take him. [Laughter]

FH:Did anyone ever try to stop them from taking the horses?

AW:No, I think they were afraid to [do that]. There were more Mexicans than there were white people. They had two or three skirmishes and one man was killed.

FH:[Did] you have quite an adventuresome trip in this part of your life?

AW:Dad started a job working on the railroad in Mexico. It was way up in the mountains. He took [our] family and we camped up there in tents for the summer while he worked on this railroad. When fall came, my mother and my oldest brother took the wagon and brought us back to town and put us in school. Things were scarce [and] our parents had a struggle getting food and [the] things that 00:08:00we [needed]. I remember one time mother went to the store in Dublan [Mexico] and bought some meat to have for breakfast the next morning. [A] man let us camp under a shed inside of his yard where he kept some farming ─

FH:Equipment?

AW:─ equipment, because it was storming. She put [the] meat up in the rafters and the next morning it was gone. A cat had [taken] it. I remember my mother cried over that. She felt so bad because she needed [it]. We came on to Blanding and she stayed there with us and put us in school until dad could come home.

FH:Tell why you had to leave Mexico. This is important.

AW:[The Mexicans were] so bad and gave us so much trouble. They killed two or three men. I don't know [if] I remember exactly what caused it or not. There 00:09:00were rebels there. They weren't the real Mexicans that lived around us all the time but they were called the rebels and they were the ones causing the trouble.

FH:Were [these men] under the leadership of Pancho Villa?

AW:Yes, and they were stealing, taking everything they could lay their hands on, and shooting up the place. Before we left, the school house bell was kept quiet so that [it] could [be] used as a signal [for] all the men [to] come to the church house. [One] Sunday morning about six o'clock the bell rang. All the men got up, dressed, and went to the school house to see what the trouble was. A man had ridden from the town of Dublan, all night on horseback, to tell them that 00:10:00the rebels were headed [our] way [and were going] to set fire to the town. We were to be out of town by ten o'clock that morning. We hadn't had breakfast. [Some of] the women and [children] were still in bed. The men came home and gathered up what they could in four hours without having their breakfast. In six hours [they] gathered their teams and wagons together and met outside the town in wagon boxes. We [went] to Hachita, Mexico. That first night it rained on us all night, it just poured down. Everybody [was] in wagon boxes.

FH:Gracious, [and with] no coverage.

AW:Most of them had covers [blankets] and a lot of them had tents that they pitched. I remember dad pitched a tent. [We] had a folding cot and my 00:11:00grandmother slept in the tent on the folding cot. Mother [was] in the wagon box with [the children]. I don't think dad went to bed. He stayed up all night to keep us from being washed away! [Laughter]

FH:Was rain like that usual?

AW:No, it was in July [and] I don't know. I don't remember enough to know. It just happened to [storm and] it really rained on us. A bunch of older boys were left [in Colonia Diaz] to look after things in case [the rebels] didn't come. They [were] to keep the stock fed and take care of things in town. But [the rebels] came and shot at the boys and chased them clear across the border. [They] shot one boy's horse out from under him. He got on another [horse that 00:12:00was] close by. My older brother, Claude, was one of the boys that stayed. He was sixteen years old. [The rebels] came and set fire to the town and burned it down. [They] shot the eyes out of the pictures on the walls. First [they] destroyed everything they could. [If you] go down there now, you can still see [the ruins].

FH:That was a sad time.

AW:Oh, [our] poor parents. I don't know how they ever stood it.

FH:What did your parents do? Where did you go?

AW:We stopped in Hachita and [stayed] in tents. The government put up tents and [gave food] rations for a while until people could gather their senses together and decide what they wanted to do and where they wanted to go. They thought they could go back in a few days, but it turned [out] they couldn't. The town was burned down so there was nothing to go back to. They [stayed] there and waited [while] deciding where they wanted to go. Dad had [a] brother in Tucson [Arizona] so he decided to go [there]. The government charged him $50.00 a head 00:13:00[for] duty on his own horses and he was still an American citizen. He raised his horses from colts, most of them, [and] they charged him $50.00 a head [for] duty to get them across the line. He had to [find] somebody to [set up] his bond because he didn't have [the money for] his bond. He went to Tucson.

My mother lived in a tent and cooked on a campfire until [he] sent the money back to pay for their horses. [He] paid the bill off [and] then we moved into a house that a Mexican family had moved out of in Tucson. Dad worked on a big 00:14:00ranch [where they] raised all kinds of grain. He was there quite a while and [became] foreman of the [ranch]. They called it Rolling Hills [and] he was foreman [there]. They used a lot of horses and mules and he was good with [them].

But there wasn't [any] church there [so] that we could go to Sunday school. We were going to school with more Mexicans in Tucson than we went with in Mexico. Dad and mother weren't satisfied with it, so they saved their money, all they could. Dad was making pretty good money for those times. They paid in $20.00 gold pieces. Mother had a little baking powder can and every nickel left over, every $20.00 she could get a hold of that she didn't have to have, she would drop it in this can, [so they could accumulate] enough to move on. When the can [was] full, they decided they had enough to buy hay, grain, and food for [all] 00:15:00of us.

[Dad] had a sister that had gone to Blanding from Mexico. Blanding was just a new town [and] hadn't been settled very long. She wrote and told him that she would [inaudible]. So we went to Blanding. [We were] thirty days and nights on the road.

FH:Thirty days and nights from ─

AW:─ from Tucson to Blanding. [We] came to the San Juan River and it was full of water [from a] big flood. We waited for it to go down [but] it didn't go down. Dad felt like we had to get across [the river] before it got higher [or] washed out. [We] had a riding horse that [was] led behind. They had four horses on the wagon and led a horse. He got on the riding horse and rode him across, back and forth, so he could locate a place that had a pretty good bottom in it. [He] came back, got on the wagon, and started across. [He was] about halfway 00:16:00[across] the stream and his lead horse stepped in a hole and fell. The wagon box started to turn right down the stream.

[Afterwards], I heard my dad say he was never so scared in all his life. [He] thought his whole family was going down the river. But he had what you call a black whip and he reached over and tapped that horse on the ears and hollered his name, "Prince, get out of there." [The horse] scrambled to his feet and got us out. Dad said if it had been any one of the other horses we would have never [survived]. The two [horses] that were next to the wagon were just young colts and they didn't know about water. But this old horse [did]! Dad had [worked with 00:17:00this] horse [all of it's] life [and] he pretty well knew Dad and Dad knew him. They got us out of there [or] in just a little while we would have been gone.

FH:A miracle!

AW:We had a bucket on the back of the wagon and when we [came out of the river] the bucket was full of water! [Laughter] All our bedding [and belongings] was wet but we got out alive.

There was another couple with us. A young couple [who had] been married a short time. They had a wagon box with two mules and dad knew that they couldn't trust the mules in the water. So he took his team back and brought their wagon over. He didn't trust the mules. When we [were] up on the mesa we [could] see the lights of Blanding; that night we were sure tickled. It seemed like it must have been a Tuesday night because I think they were having Mutual [Improvement Association]. But it seemed like it was miles and miles after we saw the lights before we got to the town, though! [Laughter] [It was] after dark.

FH:Did you have a place to go to and stay?

AW:Dad had a sister there and we stayed with them that night. We had a tent and wagon box and pitched the tent until we found something else for shelter. We rented a house that winter. It wasn't a house; it had been a granary. There was a basement [and] it was half-full of water all winter. My mother had rheumatism all winter long [and] she could hardly get around. Dad couldn't find work [in Blanding]. He did a little bit of freighting but it wasn't enough to keep us going. [The] next spring [dad and mother] decided to go to Idaho. [Dad] had a brother in Idaho. We [left] for Idaho the next spring and spent another thirty 00:19:00days on the road. [Laughter]

FH:That was a long trip!

AW:[Here is] one of those faith-promoting instances that I was talking about. We [came] to a stream of water. It was [very] deep but not very wide, kind of [a] narrow gully. It was close to the railroad tracks and [we] didn't know how to get [our] wagons over there. [We found] some old [railroad] ties and laid them side by side and rolled the wagons across on the ties. There were two other fellows with dad, two families, and they wanted to take the horses and lead them across on those ties. Dad was against it. He wanted to swim them over. [The] two of them [were] against him, so he gave in. They took dad's big stallion across in the water and the ties turned with him and he fell right in the stream of 00:20:00water on his back. Dad was leading him, so he put the rope up over a limb of a tree and held his head up out of the water until they got the boards away so he could turn over and scramble out of there.

FH:He got out alright?

AW:He got out. While he was working on the horse, my mother took her little family and went behind some bushes and knelt down and prayed that they would get the horse out. [Emotional] When we [returned] he was out.

FH:There is a lot of power in that kind of faith.

AW:But after that, they swam the rest of them around like dad wanted to in the beginning.

FH: You went on from there, all the way to ─

AW:We went right through Salt Lake City [Salt Lake County, Utah] in a wagon box, [right] up Main Street! A while back I was up there with my granddaughter and we [stayed at] a motel room on Main Street and I was telling her about it. I said, "Valerie, Grandma went up this street in a wagon box one time with four head of 00:21:00horses [leading] it." She said, "Grandma, what did they think?" I said, "Honey, everybody was in horses and wagon boxes then!" [Laughter]

FH:It was just as good as anybody else had.

AW: It was just as good as anybody else had! [Laughter]

FH:This illustrates how valuable this record is.

AW:I [have] told them these things but a lot of it they won't remember.

FHA lot haven't heard it [either], that are yet to come. Let's [continue].

AW:We went to Oakley [Idaho but] dad couldn't find work that winter. He chopped 00:22:00[fence] posts in snow up to his knees. [He would] come home every night with his pants and shoes frozen stiff until he [became] sick. He was sick the rest of the winter. They were discouraged. They didn't know where they wanted to go and what they wanted to do. He and his brother [in Idaho] went back to Blanding the next spring. They bought a lot and built a little house on it then. [It was a] couple of rooms. We lived in those two rooms for a number of years. Later on, dad added on and made quite a nice home out of it.

FH:Blanding down in southeastern Utah. How long did you stay there?

AW:I stayed there until I married. My folks still owned the home [then]. I have a brother that lives in the old home now. [The children] have scattered [and] moved around, here, there, and everywhere.

FH:[Did] you attend church during these years that you were growing up?

AW:Yes, we went to [The] Church [of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints] all the time.

FH:[Did] you [attend] Primary and [the] other organizations that were available to you?

AW:Sunday school, Mutual [Improvement Association], Sacrament Meeting; we went to all of them. But we all had to get out and earn our wages as soon as we possibly could. I started working [by] doing day work for people when I was thirteen years old. [I went] into people's homes and helped with their house work.

One time in Blanding I worked for a woman, I won't mention names. [Laughter] I washed on a [wash]-board all day long, just as hard as I could wash. I was just finishing up when night came. She wanted me to take the lantern and go out and 00:24:00scrub the porch. I refused [and] told her I was through and [was] going home. [Laughter] She paid me in carrots, beans, squash and [other vegetables].

FH:This is the way you [put] food [on] the table.

AW:Later on, I was eighteen years old [and] I [found] a job working in Hansen's Restaurant in Monticello [San Juan County, Utah]. I worked there three years. [I] used to go home for a month, or so, in the winter and stay. One winter I had rheumatism [and] had my tonsils out. The doctor took them out [because] they were infected and I had rheumatism.

FH:[Did] this take care of your rheumatism?

AW:I [haven't] had very much since but I was down for about a month, just as 00:25:00helpless as I could be. Every joint [ached].

.

FH:[Were] your joints sore and your muscles stiff?

AW:Oh yes, [inaudible]. I couldn't even move my head. I couldn't move anywhere, I was completely helpless.

FH:This [sounds] like rheumatic fever.

AW:Yes, I think it was. They didn't call it that then but I think that is what I had.

FH:[You are] fortunate [that] it didn't leave a bad result. What [do] you remember most about your father?

AW:Dad was a hard-working [and] honest man. He was honest enough that [when his] brother [went] to a bank in Salt Lake City, after we came out of Mexico, [he] wanted a loan and they asked him some questions. He said, "Are you related to 00:26:00John Rowley?" He said, "Yes." [The banker] said, "That is good enough for me." He was just as honest as the day is long and a hard-working man. He was a good man, a good father, and a good husband. He never did get over it [when] mother died. He pined his life away after she died.

FH:When did she die? How old was he when she died. Was he quite old?

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AW:[She] died in September 1931. Dad was about sixty-four years old. He was a lonesome man all the rest of his life. He died in 1949.

FH:In other words, there was a void left when she [died].

AW:Every time he would get sick he would say, "Why did mother have to leave me? Why did mother have to leave me?" He did a lot of temple work before he died.

FH:What do you remember about your mother?

AW:My mother was the best housekeeper and cook in the world. She has one sister and I heard her say more than once that she would rather eat off of my mother's floors than some people's tables. My brothers all say now there was no cook in the world like their mother. She could make a meal out of nothing. She was a very economical cook and a very tasty cook. Her family meant a lot to her. She spent hours and hours and hours sewing and cooking.

FH:[Did] she have a lot of hardships to go through in her life.

AW:Oh, yes! When they went to Mexico ─ maybe I should have started there.

FH:That is alright, tell about it now.

AW:She was expecting her third child when they went to Mexico. She and her sister went together and both were expecting babies. They moved the saw mill down from central Arizona into Mexico. They were going to saw lumber for the pioneers down there [and] make themselves a living. They just got to the border [when] mother took sick and lost her baby. It [was] buried beside the road. Her 00:29:00stepmother was a midwife and she stayed with her. Her sister and her family went on [and] when they caught up with them her sister had a baby girl [that] had been born in the meantime. Mother lost hers, a little boy, [and] buried [him] alongside the road. She had a lot of trouble.

FH:How many children did she have all together?

AW:She had thirteen [children but] only raised seven of them.

FH:Did [the other six] all live for a while?

AW:Yes, long enough to get names.

FH:There were seven [children] that lived, including yourself. Can you tell a little bit about them, their names and what happened to them?

AW:My older sister, [Mary Eliza], is married and lives in Logan [Cache County, Utah]. She is seventy [years old].

FH:When was she born?

AW:She was born in 1892.

FH:Who did she marry?

AW:[She was] born March 24, 1892.

FH:[What is] the name of her husband?

AW:[His name is] Edward Stevens.

FH:Did they have quite a family?

AW:No, they only had two girls. [This] was his second marriage [and] he had a 00:31:00family by another woman.

FH:What about the rest of your family?

AW:[My brother], Claude [Rowley], he married Olea Nielsen. He was born in 1896. He lives over in Toquerville [Washington County, Utah]. You ought to go over and talk to him. Then we had two or three in between there. I don't know where those that died come in. I think there were three of them older [than me].

FH:They all lived just a short time.

AW:Then I came next. I have a sister, Merle [Rowley, who] married Clifford Reed. She lives in Salem, Oregon. My other sister's name is Montez. That is a Spanish 00:32:00name, Montez [Rowley] Black. She lives in Henderson, Nevada. I have a brother, Vernon Rowley, [and] he lives in Las Vegas [Nevada]. I have a brother, Wilbur [Rowley and] he lives in Meadow [Millard County, Utah]. He married Ila Wright. Vernon married Charity Leavitt. She was from Bunkerville [Nevada]. I think that is all of them.

FH:Have they all done pretty well? Do you feel [that they] have they lived up to the expectations of their parents?

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AW: I think most of us have. If they could come back and see what we have done, I think they would be proud of us.

FH:You really think they could come back and see what you've done, don't you?

AW:I think they know.

FH:Sure. [Are there] any faith-promoting incidents, other than what you have 00:33:00told, that you want to tell about? In the life of your parents [or] your family?

AW:I remember after we [went] to Blanding, mother was expecting another baby. It would have made fourteen [children] but she lost it. There weren't any doctors [or a] midwife and they thought they were going to lose her. They had the elders come and administer to her. Before they got to the gate as they were leaving, 00:34:00she was alright. Everything turned out alright.

FH:Sometimes, as Latter-day-Saints, this is such a commonplace thing that we fail to remember how wonderful it is.

AW:That [is] right.

FH:What you did you do when you were growing up just to have fun? What kind of fun things did you do?

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AW:I don't know. [Laughter] I played with stick dolls and climbed trees. We had 00:35:00a great big cottonwood tree right against the house in [Colonia] Diaz [and] we used to make a play house up in the top of the tree. [Laughter] We had one tamarisk [tree] down in the field [and] we used to teeter-totter on it. We just made our own entertainment, anything we happened to find [to do]. We had an old riding horse; you couldn't catch her because she was so fast, but after you caught her you couldn't get off [to] walk. [Laughter] We would put her out in the pasture and [then] go up and get her. There was a ditch run through [the pasture and] she would stay on one side, opposite from us, [and] we would have to find a narrow place to jump across. By the time we got across she would be back on the other side again! After you caught her, you could have got off [to] walk.

FH:[Laughter]

AW:We had lots of fun [with] her. [Laughter]

FH:Did you ever [have] anything like a candy pull?

AW:We did at home. We would make molasses candy. Dad's sister and her husband 00:36:00had a molasses mill not far from the farm we had. They used to make a lot of molasses, molasses candy, [and] popcorn.

FH:What did you have in the winter time in the way of fruit? Did you do [any] canning?

AW:No, [not fruit] ─ only tomatoes. They used to have great big five-gallon cans that they put [the] tomatoes in. They put rosin around the top of [the cans] to seal [them] up. I don't remember if we had any bottles at all. I [don't] even remember seeing a fruit jar down there at all.

FH:Did they dry fruit?

AW:Yes, we dried a lot of fruit, peaches, pears, apricots, [and] apples. I can remember cutting them up and putting them on top of the house to dry. [I remember] getting up there and spreading them out on sheets to dry. Yes, we had sacks of dried fruit and dried corn. We could raise winter gardens [of] carrots, radishes, and onions.

FH:Was it a little warmer than St. George?

AW:Yes.

FH:Did you participate in sports of any kind when you were in school?

AW:I didn't in school. After I [was] out of school, a group of us in Blanding got together and formed a baseball team. [There were] two different groups and 00:38:00we played each other. [One] time we would win [and] the next time they would win. That was all there was, [but] nothing in school.

FH:Did music play a part in your life? Do you like music?

AW:Oh, I love music, but I've never been a musician. I did sing in the choir [when] I was in Blanding, until I left. I always sing when I go to church. I love to sing. I never was expert at it. [Laughter] I have two brothers [who] have sung duets and solos all their lives. [They sing] at funerals and [in] church. [My] two sisters younger than me did a lot of singing and still do, I guess.

FH:Was your family musical?

AW:Yes. Dad and mother used to sing when they had parties. They were always 00:39:00called on to sing together. I have [a song] here in this little book that they sang all the time.

FH:Have you enjoyed reading?

AW:I used to read lots of stories [and] books.

FH:[Did you read] novels?

AW:[Some] novels, but I haven't read a novel for a long time. I read mostly 00:40:00church books now. [I am] about halfway through the Book of Mormon and The Doctrine and Covenants. [I don't know] whether I'll ever [read] it at all! [Laughter]

FH:But you do enjoy it?

AW:Yes, I like to read.

FH:Now-a days you have an easier way, just watch television!

AW:TV [television] is too easy now! [Laughter]

FH:Tell about your courtship and marriages and [events] that have gone on [from] here in your life.

AW:When I went to Monticello to work, I met Rex Perkins. He was from Nevada. He was working there and we [went] together for about a year and [were] married. We moved up to Sigurd [Sevier County], Utah to the coal mines. [He] worked in the 00:41:00coal mines for a long time. He had a brother on a farm in Idaho [who] raised potatoes up there. We went up there and lived a year or so on the farm. That was where our first baby was born. Her name was Daphne Ray [Perkins]. She lived a year and [came down with] pneumonia and measles [at the same time] and died.

FH:That is a combination that would be hard to overcome.

AW:It was eight years later before Mabel [Perkins] was born.

FH:Where was she born?

AW:She was born in Blanding. It was so cold up in Idaho and we didn't like it. He got a chance to run a farm in Moapa Valley [Nevada]. So we went down there. 00:42:00We lived on that farm for a couple of years. The people that owned it decided they wanted to take it back themselves. We went to Mesa, Arizona and lived there all winter. Dad was alone and kept writing wanting us to come live with [him] because he was alone. I didn't have any children and the rest of them did and they thought I ought to go and [care] for Dad. So [we] went back [to Blanding] and lived. That was where Rex and I had our first trouble. It was a mistake to move back because everybody takes advantage of you.

FH:Sure.

AW:He didn't like it [and] wasn't very happy with it. That was where Mabel was born, in Blanding. Then he left when she was six months old and we haven't lived 00:43:00together again. He went back to Nevada and got a divorce there. I lived with [my] dad.

After that, I went to California and stayed with an aunt down there and Mabel was just a baby. I stayed down there a year and worked at anything that I could find [to] keep her with me. I wouldn't let anybody else tend her so I took any job I could find [doing] house work. Dad was alone again and my brother and his wife came down there and talked me into going back up [and] staying with dad. I went back up and stayed for seven years, lived in his house, and took care of him.

I came over to Parowan [Iron County, Utah] to a Rowley reunion and I met Delbert Wilcock over there. He had been alone quite a while and I had too. I went back 00:44:00home [and] he wrote to me [for] quite a while. We decided to get married. He was a good man. We moved [to] a farm over by Panguitch [Garfield County, Utah] to a place called Spry. [It was] named after Governor [William] Spry. We lived there for five years. He was crossing the highway and was hit by a car and killed.

That left me alone again. I took what I had and went to Boulder City [Nevada]. I had two sisters living there and [I found] a job cooking [at] the hospital. I [worked there as a] cook for five years. Then I had to have an operation. [The] doctor told me I had to have a stomach operation. [He] sent me to a doctor in Cedar City [Iron County, Utah], Doctor Grant. I got rid of everything I had down 00:45:00there, took Mabel, and [we] went up to Cedar City.

My sister, Mary Eliza, came over from Blanding and stayed with her [Mabel] in the motel while I was in the hospital. I went home with her to Blanding until I got my strength back. I went to work too soon and [have] suffered with it ever since.

FH:This left you to take care of your little daughter. How old was she when you had this operation? Was she a little girl?

AW:No, she was in the last year of high school. We went [back] to Blanding and she finished school there. She had a few more subjects she had to take but they 00:46:00didn't give them [in Blanding] so we decided to come to St. George so she could get the one or two subjects [at] the college to finish up that way. That is why we came here, so she [could go] to school. She met Jack Holt and married him. I went back to Blanding but I couldn't stay there alone.

FH:You had to come back here again? [Laughter]

AW:I sure did!

FH:[She married] Jack Holt? What is his father's name?

AW:[His name is] Leroy Holt.

FH:What does [Jack] do to make a living?

AW:When she married him, they owned a grocery store [Dixie Market]. They went in with his brother and brother-in-law and they built the Twin Oaks Motel here. 00:47:00[They] sold the grocery store and built [the motel]. He just sold [the motel] this last spring. In the meantime, he has been building apartments. He has ten apartments here that he rents.

FH:[Are they] by the school?

AW:Yes, close to the school. And he [does] little jobs on the side. He sprays pebble stone on ceilings [and] makes pretty good money doing that. He is a good provider and [they have] a lovely home. He is good to his wife and his [children].

FH:How many children do they have?

AW:They've three [children].

FH:Three children, what are they?

AW:Valerie is [fourteen years old] and Kenny will be twelve [years old] in December. Diane was five [years old and has] started school.

FH:A boy and two girls.

AW:They are good to me. They [don't] go anyplace and leave me. If the parents 00:48:00don't mention it the [children] do, so I get in on everything! [Laughter]

FH:Wonderful! [Are] you are living right next door to them now?

AW:Yes, just through the fence!

FH: Do you think you have any problems with the traditional mother-in-law stories that [people] tell?

AW:We haven't had any [problems] yet!

FH:[Laughter] That speaks well.

AW:I think Jack was afraid we would have in the first place [laughter] but I think he got over it!

FH:What are your future plans? [Do] you have any plans? What do you want to do most with the rest of your life?

AW:Just stay out here and watch my grandchildren grow up. [I want to] be as close as I can to them.

FH:Have you quit working now?

AW:Yes.

FH:Did you spent a lot of years working?

AW:Oh yes, I sure did!

FH:Most of the time, what [was] your work?

AW:When I was married to Rex, I didn't work. [I was] just a housewife. When I was married to Delbert, I didn't [work] either. When I was in Blanding with my dad [and] was keeping an eye out for him, I was working on school lunches.

FH:You have been connected with food or food preparation most of the time.

AW:When I married again, I was on the farm. Then I went down there and went to the hospital down there. I worked all together sixteen years as a cook in the hospital.

FH:[Are] you active in temple work now?

AW:Yes, I go [when] I can. Sometimes I can't [go] but I go when I can. In the summer I don't go as much, it [is] too hot and I have my lot to take care of 00:50:00[but] in the winter I spend most of [my] time in the temple.

FH:Do you think that life has taught you any particular lessons that you feel are important?

AW:Yes. I think, for example, to learn to think about other people and not yourself so much. I think we have to be honest with people. Treat people like you would like to be treated, if you want to get along.

FH:That is the only way you can be happy.

AW:I think so.

FH:In view of this fact, what would you counsel your descendants? What kind of counsel would you like to give them after [your] life-time of experience?

AW: There are [a] lot of things I would like to say if I had the words to say it.

FH:Try to say those things that come to your mind and heart.

AW:I don't know. Be honest with ourselves and everybody else and stay close to the gospel.

FH:Do you think [a] testimony of the gospel is important?

AW:That is the most important thing, I think.

FH:I notice that you are living next door to your daughter and her husband. Has this been a very nice arrangement for you?

AW: It really has, I don't know what I would have ever done without her. She'll never know how much she has meant to me. [Emotional] She has made me so happy and she has been so good to me. She'll never know how much she has meant to me 00:52:00[and] how much I love her. I couldn't get along without any of them. [Emotional]

FH:Those little ones growing up that you have pictures of here, they mean a lot to you.

AW:I say they do, I sure love them. I want them to be good and grow up to be good [children]. [Emotional]

[END OF TAPE -- SIDE TWO]