Interview with Hannah Cynthia (Carter) Hiatt

Hannah Cynthia (Carter) Hiatt was interviewed on October 7, 1968 in St. George, Washington County, Utah by Fielding H. Harris, a representative of the Voices of Remembrance Foundation. She related her personal history of living in various parts of Utah and Nevada.

FH:Would you please give your full name?

HH:[My name is] Hannah Cynthia (Carter) Hiatt.

FH:What is your birth date?

HH:[I was born] May 25, 1917.

FH:[What was] the place of your birth?

HH:[I was born in] Provo [Utah County] Utah.

FH:What was your father's name?

HH:[His name was] Reed Carter.

FH:[What was] your mother's [full] name?

HH:[Her name was] Abby (Perkel) [DeGraw] Carter.

FH:How is [her maiden] name spelled?

HH:[It is spelled] P-E-R-K-E-L.

FH:Can you recall some of the [events] that occurred in your childhood?

HH:About the earliest recollection that I have is when I had the whooping cough. 00:01:00I was about three [years old]. I can remember how sick I was and how good it [felt] for my mother to hold me. That is about the earliest [event] I can remember.

FH:Did you have some playmates?

HH:My cousin, Weston [Carter], and I were [very] close. I was a year older than he was. We lived quite a ways from anyone else [so] we played together a lot. We have always been [very] close all our lives.

FH:Did you live awhile in the same place?

HH: We lived there until I was about six [years old]. Then we moved away from Provo.

FH:Where you lived was actually up north --.

HH:We lived up on the hill just above Carterville [Utah County, Utah].

FH:If you moved away at six [years old], that means you moved before you started in school.

HH:No. I started to school in the old Finch school in Orem [Utah County, Utah]. I went [to school] there for awhile and then we moved to Caliente, Nevada. I went to the first grade a few months there. Then we moved to Las Vegas [Nevada] and I went the last few months [of] the first grade there.

FH:Tell about your [education].

HH:When I first started school, I lived in Old Town. They used to call it [Old Town]. It is [called] North Las Vegas now. I had to cross the tracks to go to school. I would stand and wait for the trains to cross before I could go on to school.

[When] I lived in Caliente, I had to wait for a long train to go across [the 00:03:00tracks] before I could go to school. It made me late [for school]. I was afraid of the teacher [when I was] late, so I played hooky. I hid in the bushes until I [thought that] school would be out and I could go home at noon and nobody would know. Mama would think I went to school and the teacher would think I stayed home. While I was hiding in the bushes by the trail, my mother went by on the way to school. [Laughter] There I was hiding [and] playing hooky, so I did not get away with that [trick].

FH:What did she say [to you]?

HH:I cannot remember [what she said to me]. [Laughter] I probably [received] a licking!

FH:Can you remember some of your teachers?

HH: [The] first teacher I can remember [was when] I was in second grade. I used to be a latecomer to school, a ten o'clock scholar. I used to always be late. 00:04:00She did everything [to help me be on time]. I remember she put me in the book closet in the dark. That did not bother me a bit. I just ate all the apples. [Laughter] [I remember] the very last time I was ever late for school. When I came in, she put me across her knee and spanked me in front of the class. I do not think I have ever been late for anything since [then]. That cured me [of ever being late again]. She was one of the best teachers I believe I ever had.

FH:Do you remember her name?

HH: I cannot remember her name, but I can remember her spanking me. I remember my third grade teacher. [Her name] was Miss Reynolds. I do not remember too much about her, but she must have made quite an impression on me because I can remember her. I cannot remember anything that happened [in the third grade]. I remember one time [and] maybe this [incident] is what did it. One of the boys swallowed a marble in school. She took him by his heels and held him over the wastebasket and whacked him on [his] back until he coughed it up. [Laughter]

FH:She was hefty [to be able to do that to the boy].

HH:Yes. He fainted because, I guess, he was choking on it. I do not remember too much about any of my other teachers in school until [later on]. When I was ten [years old], we left Las Vegas and [moved] back to Provo. I stayed with my sister [Vernessa Edna DeGraw] there for awhile.

Then the family moved to Elberta [Utah County, Utah]. There I had the very best teacher I ever had in my life. She took an interest in me. Her name was Zina Butterfield. She was a relative [of mine]. I did not know it at the time, but she was a distant relative. I liked to sing and she decided I had a nice singing 00:06:00voice. She gave me lots of chances [to sing]. I was in operettas and used to sing in programs. I think she was my very favorite teacher. I went to school there one year. It was a little school [and] she taught three grades in one room.

From [Elberta], we moved to St. George. I was in the sixth grade when we came to St. George. I can remember [that] Harold [H.] Snow was my teacher in the sixth grade. In the north, the schools were a lot further ahead than they were down there. When I came here in March, I had had everything that they were studying here. He thought I was just an unusually smart child. When I went into the 00:07:00seventh grade, he was my teacher again. I think he thought I had lost all my sense [laughter] because I did not know anything in the seventh grade. I had to study. I remember I [received] all 'A's', but in the seventh grade he marked me way down and told me I was not doing my best.

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FH:How far did you [go] in school?

HH:I went to the third year in high school. At that time, Dixie College and [the] high school were combined. The college teachers taught high school students. I do not remember anything especially dramatic about going to school. When we first came to St. George, I remember how hard it was for me to make friends. I think I had changed schools so many times that I was afraid to make friends. Finally, I did make friends with a group of girls. We had a lot of fun 00:08:00during high school. I dropped out when I was seventeen [years old] and married. [I am still friends with] some of them after all these years. Some of them have moved away. [The] class reunion that we had last year [was] the first class reunion we have had since [we were in] school. It was quite fun. Some of the people I knew and some I could not remember at all. [Laughter]

FH:[Was it] sad that you did not get to finish [high school]?

HH:Yes, it was. I think that I might have gone ahead and finished school if I 00:09:00had been encouraged more. I planned on being married in June, but in March I [came down with] the measles. I was [very] sick with the measles for about three weeks. I missed three weeks of school and was afraid to go back. I knew I could never make it up, so my folks let me drop out. They did not try to talk me into going back. I have always regretted not being [able to finish school]. I think that maybe my life would have been different if I had gone back. I may have married [or] maybe I would not have.

FH:Did you have any accidents or sicknesses that you can remember? [Or] did you just have childhood illnesses?

HH:I had the measles and I was as sick as I [ever] was in my life. I had the 00:10:00mumps and the chickenpox.

FH:You did not have any serious illnesses?

HH:[I did] not [have any serious] illnesses.

FH:Can you recall any amusing incidents? Your husband [Edwin M. Hiatt] said there was something that --.

HH:[Laughter] We had not been married very long. My husband courted me on horseback. I had never been near a horse until I met him. We were going across the [Virgin] River. There was quite a flood down [on] the Virgin River. He and some of his cousins, a bunch of us, were out horseback riding. They forded the river [and] got across. It was quite deep [and] I was getting my feet in the water. I pulled my feet up out of the stirrups to keep them from getting wet. The old gray horse I was riding on did not like to be touched in the flanks. The next thing I knew, I was sitting in the river! Everybody laughed [at me]. That was a fun time! I [was] all wet and bedraggled. [Laughter]

FH:[You] had to go home wet. Tell about your activities [in The] Church [of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints] when you were younger.

HH:I remember when I was a small child in Las Vegas. One time I took the sacrament. That was the one and only time in my whole life that I ever went [to sacrament meeting]. We went to Sunday school some [of the time]. My parents were not too active in the church. My dad used tobacco. I think in Las Vegas they were active some [of the time]. After we came to St. George, when I was eleven 00:12:00[years old], my mother's health was very poor and my dad's health was failing, too. I would go [to church] once in awhile. I always wanted to go, but I just never seemed to get there very often. We were married in the temple. Both of us had been taught to be properly married in the temple, so that is what we did. We went to the temple in January before we were married in June.

FH: Somebody had a good influence on you.

HH:We were married in the temple, but I do not think we really took it seriously. We went because it was the thing to do.

FH:[Did] you think it was right?

HH:Yes. I am glad we did [get married in the temple]. If we had not done it then, maybe we would have never made it to the temple and had some of the other experiences that we have had.

I always wanted to teach Sunday school. My girlfriends taught Sunday school and I always wanted to [teach it] so bad. It never occurred to me to go to the bishop, or somebody, and tell them that I wanted to teach Sunday school. I was always envious of everybody [who was able] to do those things. I did not and I did not know how [to teach Sunday school]. I never did do anything in the church like that until before "Jimmy" [James Reed Hiatt] was born. We moved to Henderson [Nevada] during World War II. I was asked to teach a Primary class and it was the best thing that ever happened to me. After we moved back to St. George I was asked to teach in [the] Primary. I have been teaching [in] Primary or Sunday school or something ever since [then]. I had to get started. It has been a joy to me. I love to teach children.

FH:What you can remember about your father?

HH:Some of the memories I have about my father are not very pleasant. He was very strict with me when I was a child. I think I learned to lie the best that any [child] could learn to lie. I got to be clever about it. If I [was] caught, I knew I would get the razor strap. I got away with a lot when I was a [youngster]. [When] I think of some of the things I pulled, it makes me shiver now. I know that he loved me from some of the things that I can remember. [We were] never [close] in all our lives. When I was married, he wrote me a letter. 00:15:00In the letter, he told me how much he loved me.

FH:Even though he did not particularly express it [earlier].

HH:He was not able to express it.

FH:This helps to understand him a littler better.

HH:When we first came to St. George, he had trouble with his feet. He said he had to have a certain type of shoes or his back hurt him. I look back [now] and [think] he had Parkinson's disease. He did not realize what the [problem] was. 00:16:00He was crushed between two mine cars when he was a young man. [That was] before he was married. My parents were well along [in years] before they were married. They were about thirty [years old]. This injury and the Parkinson's [disease] affected his back. When I was still a young girl, he got to where he could not stand up straight. Even in his work, if he was standing, he would keep bending forward. He could not stand up straight.

Finally, he got to where he could not work anymore. The Parkinson's [disease] began to show up on him. His hands shook and he could not [use them]. He used to roll his own cigarettes with Bull Durham [tobacco]. He smoked until his hands shook so bad that he could not roll them anymore and he had to quit. He was a good man. I know that he had a testimony of the church after he could not work anymore. He used to read and study. After he quit using tobacco he [was] closer 00:17:00to the church. Their health was so bad [that] they could not go out or go to church and do things there for a few years. They did go to the temple as much as they could. It seemed like after he quit using tobacco, life was better for him. Their life together was much better.

FH:Maybe this was a blessing in disguise.

HH:[It came] kind of late. [Laughter]

FH:Sometimes we cannot always tell about that.

HH:I felt bad about it. My [children] were growing up at the same time. Out of 00:18:00six boys, we have four [who] use tobacco. I know that that had an influence on them. [They saw that] their grandfather used it. I hope that these boys will realize that they are having such an influence on their children and other children's lives. I try to talk to them and tell them, but they do not pay much attention [to me].

FH:Maybe sometime they will pay attention [to you]. What do you remember about your mother?

HH:My mother was born in Idaho. Her family was quite well-to-do when she was young. They had a big farm and she had everything that she wanted and needed. They had to work hard. I think she probably had rheumatic fever when she was a young girl. She remembered that her sister and all the boys could always go out and romp and play, but her mother always made her stay in the house and be 00:19:00quiet. She learned to be very kind and patient.

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HH:Her first marriage was unhappy. She had three little girls [who lived from that marriage]. Her first child was a boy, which was stillborn. She was not supposed to ever have any more children, but she had three little girls. One little girl [Altha Theora DeGraw] died [when] she was about three months old. When they were still [young], her husband was kind of a rascal, so she divorced him and left him. She went to Provo. Her uncle, John Brimhall, was the president of Brigham Young University [Provo, Utah County, Utah]. He [had] her come down there and helped her get work. She used to work in the old woolen mills. [She] supported her two little girls [Vernessa Edna and Nellie Arrilla DeGraw] and herself by working there and doing dressmaking. I never did find out just how [my mother and dad] met. They were married September 23, 1914.

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HH:They were happy. Their first child [a little girl] was stillborn. Then they had me and then another [stillborn] daughter. All three [of the children were] little girls. The third one was stillborn. They never had any more children, so I grew up all alone. My two half-sisters [Vernessa Edna and Nellie Arrilla DeGraw] were nearly eleven [years old] and twelve [years old] when I was born. I 00:21:00think they thought I was quite cute when I was a baby. After I [was] a little older, I was a pest to them. [Laughter] I do not have very many happy memories of family relationships with my sisters. They were too much older than I was. I felt most of the time that I was just the right age to be a good babysitter when they married and had children.

FH:Did you baby sit for them?

HH:You bet! [I did babysit for] the one sister [Nellie]. We moved to Las Vegas shortly after the older sister [Vernessa] was married. My second sister [Nellie] moved down there with us and married a fellow down there. [His name was] Harvey Sprague. [He lived] in Las Vegas. I babysat her [children] up until I had a family of my own.

My mother used to do nursing. She nursed the hard way like they used to do years ago. She helped deliver babies. She delivered a few of them by herself. She would go for ten days and take care of the mother and baby. She used to take me with her when I was [very young]. I know because I have been told about it. I always wanted a baby brother or sister. We went to this home when she was taking care of [a] baby. I thought it was so cute and I wanted it so bad. They said, "Well, I will tell you what, if you can find a pocket big enough to put the baby in, we will let you have it." I went home and I hunted for the biggest pocket that I could find. I was so disappointed when the baby would not fit in it so I could not have it. [Laughter]

FH:[Did] you take them at their word?

HH:Children do. She did all this nursing work when we moved to Elberta. She was 00:23:00gone all the time doing nursing in Las Vegas. She was the head nurse at the Henderson Hospital. [That was] the first hospital they had in Las Vegas. She was [the] head nurse there.

She had rheumatic fever when she was a child and her heart was not very good. That is one of the reasons they left Provo. The elevation [was too high and] her health started failing. She could not breathe well up there. They moved to Las Vegas and she felt better there. I cannot remember any time that my mother was not working.

After we came to St. George, her health failed completely. She was not able to 00:24:00do anything more. She took care of her family. My sister's [Nellie] health was poor. She spent the rest of her time and strength taking care of her and her children until I married. When I married, without my help, she could not do it anymore. My sister had to go back and live with her husband [Harvey Sprague] and take care of her own [children]. [Laughter] Mama's health failed, but she was able to take care of dad through his illness. He had Parkinson's [disease] for about fifteen years before his death. He died June 22, 1955 [in St. George, Utah].

FH:I [am sure] she was a great blessing to him.

HH:She certainly was [a blessing to him]. All that kept her going was taking care of him. That is all she lived for was doing for people anyway. For about fifteen years, he was nearly helpless. He could not feed himself. He could not do anything for himself at all. He could get up and walk around a little bit in the house or out in the yard. We had to watch him because he could not control his feet. He was bent over so he was top heavy. He would start to run and if you did not catch him, he would fall down. Before he died, she nursed him back [to health]. Nobody knows the things that she did for him. [She] bathed him and made him comfortable. One time he was [very] sick. The doctor did not think he would 00:26:00get better. She nursed him, took care of him and brought him back up again. The last time he [was very] bad, I remember being in the room with her. She said, "Now, never mind, Reed, we will get you over this." He looked at her and said, as plain as anybody could talk, and it was hard for him to talk plain, "If you do, you will be sorry." So she just gave up and he went into a coma and in three days he died. She had nursed him back to health and got him back I do not know how many times.

FH:He knew it was better if he did not have to go on.

HH:He did not want to go on anymore. It seemed like, after he died, she failed. She was exhausted from nursing him for so many years. She was so lonesome 00:27:00without him. Within seven months, she died [on January 27, 1956 in St. George, Utah].

FH:That was probably a blessing for both of them.

HH:Yes. They could not be happy apart.

FH:During the time that he was sick, did you ever have him administered to?

HH:Yes. He was administered to every time he would get [very] bad. He had a lot of pain in his back. It hurt so badly. He suffered a lot of pain. They would call the elders in and administer to him. That would relieve him right away. He would go to sleep. [This] occurred time after time after time.

FH:Sometimes the blessings that we witnessed are so commonplace to us that we forget their importance.

HH:That is true.

FH:What did you [do] when you were growing up to have a good time? Did you have a good time?

HH:Yes. I was by myself mostly. I remember when I was a child in Las Vegas. My friends would come to play with me and I would give them anything they wanted. I never had any toys because I gave them away to all [my friends] if they would stay a little bit longer. I thought a lot of times when my [children] were growing up, how many [youngsters] I caused to get a licking when they got home because they stayed too long. [Laughter] I was lonely and I liked to have the [youngsters] come and play. I coaxed them to stay longer. I learned to entertain myself, too.

I played paper dolls [for] hours and hours and hours. There was a big tamarisk tree in the corner of the yard. It had a hollowed out place in the middle. I 00:29:00would sit with my paper dolls and a shoebox [for] hours and hours and play paper dolls.

I liked to read. I read everything I could get my hands on. I was always a fast reader. I could read four books in a week. I would go to the library after we came to St. George. They let me take four books out. That was the most I could take [out at one time]. I would read them and take them back and get four more. I believe I read everything that was readable in the library except the dictionary. I even used to like to read the dictionary. I would sit for hours and read the dictionary to see how many new words I could learn.

FH:You received a [good] education from all that reading.

HH:Yes. I still like the dictionary and finding new words.

FH:What kind of reading did you enjoy?

HH:I liked adventure stories. After I [was] up in my teens, I liked love stories. I always liked adventure stories about different places in the world. I remember when I found the Tarzan books. I loved them. I read them over and over again.

FH:Edgar Rice Burroughs [wrote those books].

HH:[I liked] all [of] his books. He had other good ones. I cannot think of the names of them now.

FH:He had some about the men of Mars. [The stories were about] Martians.

HH:Yes. I just loved to read them. I would go get them after awhile and read them all over again because I liked them so well.

FH:Did you like [to read] Zane Grey's [books]?

HH:No. I never did like Zane Grey too much.

FH:[Did you ever read] Tale of the Limber Lost?

HH:Yes. I liked all those books.

FH:Has reading played some part in your religious life later [on]?

HH:It always has [played a part in my life], but I sure do not read as much as I like to now. [Laughter]

FH:Have you gotten out of the habit now?

HH:I have gotten out of the habit. [There have been] too many years that I did not have enough time to read.

FH:[Did] you have two sisters?

HH:[I had] two sisters. My oldest half-sister [Vernessa Edna DeGraw] died the year we were married. I do not want to leave that out. We were married in June [1934]. When we married, mama went up and stayed with Vernessa [Edna DeGraw] for the rest of the summer. Later [on], we made a trip up there.

FH:Where was this?

HH:[It was in] Provo. My oldest sister, [Vernessa Edna], married Lloyd Sundquist. They had six children -- four girls and two boys. The two boys were twins. It was late in the summer [and] we made a trip up there and visited them. 00:32:00We came back, but mama still stayed up there for awhile.

In October, Vernessa had a miscarriage and [had] streptosepticemia, an infection, and she died. I cannot remember the day she died. She died [November 19, 1934] and left six little children. The oldest [child], Theora, was ten years old. Emma was two [years old]. Lloyd did not know how he would ever manage. Mama's health was bad so she could not take care of them. Edwin and I decided we would stay up there and help take of the [children]. We stayed with 00:33:00him about three months, November, December and January. Dad [her husband] could not get any work up there, so we decided to come back down here. The oldest girl, Theora, was a willful child.

[END OF TAPE ONE -- SIDE ONE]

HH:I can see now how she missed her mother and [that caused] the problems she had. She would not mind me at all. She would not do anything that I asked her to 00:34:00do. Finally, one day I was trying to get her to do something and she threw [a pair of] scissors at me. [She] just missed me with the scissors. I realized then that I could not handle her. That is the reason we left and came back to St. George.

After she was married and had a family, we were visiting [one time]. I have always felt close to [them] because I realized their problems and [became] close to them [by] taking care of them. [Many] years after she had a family of her own, we always stopped there when we went up north. [One time] she said, "Aunt Hannah, I am so sorry." I said, "What are you sorry about?" She said, "For throwing the scissors at you." She had always remembered.

FH:It had bothered her all those years. What about the other sister?

HH:[Her name was] Nellie [Arrilla DeGraw]. She always lived at home. Mama raised her family until I married. I must have helped them a little. I remember I used to wash all the diapers. [Laughter] Her husband [Harvey] worked out at Pioche [Nevada] in the mines. Mama's health was so [bad] that she could not take care of the children anymore [and] dad was getting to where he needed more care.

Nellie moved back out to Pioche. They made a home out there. For awhile they lived there and then they bought a place in Panaca [Nevada] and lived out there. The [children] would come in and stay with mama. Nellie had nine children. The 00:36:00oldest girl had a mental breakdown when she was in her teens. It is my own personal opinion [that] it was too much responsibility. When she left here, Marjorie had to take over and do the work that mama had been doing before. It was too much for her and she had a mental breakdown. Everybody knows where she is now. She is in the hospital in Carson City [Nevada]. They raised their family in Panaca. She had four more children after they moved out there. Her husband 00:37:00[Harvey] was killed in an automobile accident when the youngest girl, Linda, was about four years old. She has been on her own since then. Their family has not been close. They separated [and] I do not know whether they even know where each other is anymore. It is a lesson to not do too much for people. You cripple them when you help them and do too much for them. It is sad and I feel sorry for them.

FH:Let them stand on their own.

HH:Yes. [It is] better to have a few hard knocks than to be waited on too much.

FH:That is a lesson that is hard to learn sometimes.

HH:Nellie and I have never been close. I do not feel any closer to her than I do to the neighbor across the street. I feel [very] sad about it, but we do not 00:38:00have a close relationship.

FH:There is one more phase of your life: when you were growing up, [did] you like sports?

HH:Yes. In school, I loved to play baseball. I must have been a little bit good because I was on the team. We did not play it like they play baseball now. Now, the girls play baseball in church. I was on the school team. We went over to Santa Clara [Washington County, Utah] and played the Santa Clara team. [We played] inter-school teams. I loved to play baseball. I still like to [play baseball]! [Laughter]

FH:Do you [still play] once in awhile?

HH:I did when I worked at [The] Hawthorne [Company]. The first year I worked there they decided [to] get up a baseball team. The tent department played the sleeping bag department. Believe it or not, the old women's tent department beat 00:39:00them twice! [Laughter] It was fun!

FH:Tell about how you met your husband, about your courtship and marriage.

HH:I met [some] girls I thought were nice and we were friendly. I would go over to their house and they would come down to my house. One [girlfriend] was a year older than I was [and] we were good friends. She had [a] brother and he [Edwin M. Hiatt] took a liking to me. He said that a long time ago, I used to throw mock oranges at him when we went by. We lived over by the temple in the old Hunt house. It is torn down now. He would ride his horse down the street [when] going out to the field to work. I know I threw those mock oranges. There were a lot of 00:40:00people [who] went by [our house]. I must have thrown some at him. He said I did. He asked me out. I remember that whenever we went out, we had to take Elva [Hiatt] with us because she wanted to go.

FH:Was [she] his sister?

HH:Yes, that was his sister. We would take Elva home and he would walk me home. We walked. We did not ride in any fancy cars -- we walked. I lived down where the East Elementary [school] is now. He would come down and we would walk up town to the dance or the show. We would walk Elva home and then he would walk me home. [He] rode horses. They had horses and liked to ride horses everywhere. I had never been that close to a horse before, but he introduced me to horseback riding and I enjoyed it.

FH:Was [he] with you when you [were] dumped in the [Virgin] River?

HH:Yes. [Laughter] I remember one time [when] Elva and I were riding a horse. She was in the saddle and I was sitting on the back and [we were] jogging along. The darn [horse] was sure slippery and I slipped right off the back. She went on up the street. She did not know she had lost me until she got to the house and she came back for me. [Laughter]

FH:You did not yell?

HH:I was too surprised! He thought he wanted to get married for a long time. He was sure he wanted to get married, but I was not sure. I did not want to get married [because] I was too young. I had not done anything or gone anywhere. Finally, he wore me down and we were engaged right after Christmas in 1933. We were married June 1, 1934. The wedding date was set for May 25, [1934]. It was my birthday. My dad told me I could not get married while I was sixteen [years old]. I had to at least wait until I was seventeen [years old], so that is why 00:42:00we set it for May 25, [1934]. On June 20, [1934] he would [be] twenty-one [years old]. We went up to get our [marriage] license. They would not let him have a license unless he had his dad's consent. They were living up at Sulphurdale [Beaver County, Utah]. So he hitchhiked and walked up there and [received] a note from his dad so we could get the license. That was too late for [the] May [date], so we waited for one week more. [We waited until] June 1 and [were] married.

FH:He was really old enough, but they would not believe him.

HH:[He was] twenty days [too young]. They will not give it to you until you are twenty-one [years old]. [Laughter]

FH:Where were you married?

HH:We were married in the St. George Temple. While mama [was in] Provo, we lived in their house for a while. We took care of my sister's two oldest boys the first month we were married. We kept them and took care of them. [We had] three of them. We had the baby, too. George [Sprague] was the baby. We had the three of them. We took care of the two [oldest boys] all the time and had the baby most of the time until we went up to Provo.

FH:How old were the boys?

HH:They were about three [years old] and five [years old]. That was our honeymoon. [We were] taking care of my two little nephews. [Laughter] In those days, we did not have any money. When we [were] married, he had $5.00. He paid for the license and the hotel room and then we were broke. [Laughter]

FH:What did you do after that?

HH:He worked for the farmers a little. I look back at those years and wonder how in the world we ever lived. I will never know [how we did it]. When our first baby was born, [my husband] worked for the doctor to pay the bill.

It was funny when Jerry [Hiatt] was born [on May 5, 1935]. We went to the show and decided something was going to happen. So we left the show early and went home. Then we decided we wasted our money. We could have stayed at the show and seen it all. Finally, he decided that he better call the doctor. So he did [and] also the nurse. We used to have a nurse [who did nursing] like my mother used to do. [The nurse would] come and help deliver the baby. Then she would come and 00:45:00take care of the mother and the baby for ten days. I cannot remember her name. He got the doctor and the nurse. The doctor came down. [His name was] old Dr. Donald [Alpine] McGregor. He said, "She is not going to have this baby for hours. I have had a hard day. I am going to go home and sleep awhile. I will come back in an hour or two and see how things are going." He left and I was feeling good. I was not having any pain or anything. After awhile, the nurse decided she would check and see what was happening. All of a sudden, she [put] her hands in the air and said, "Help, help, this baby is being born right now! Go get the doctor, quick!" So my husband ran across the street, called the doctor and told him to come quick. He just [came] back in the door when [the baby] was born. My mother-in-law [Maybelle (McCain) Hiatt] was there and said, "Are you going to cut the cord?" [The nurse] said, "No, the doctor has been paid. Let him do his work." So we waited for twenty-five minutes until the 00:46:00doctor [arrived] to do his job. I will never forget that [birth]. [It] was so funny. [Laughter] My mother-in-law was having a fit!

FH:What was this child's name?

HH:[His name is] Edwin Jerry[Hiatt]. We named him Edwin for his father.

FH:Tell about your other children.

HH:Our next [child was a] girl [Wynona Hiatt] due in September [1936]. Jerry would have been sixteen months old when she was born. Suddenly, on July 23, [1936] we [realized that] we were going to have an addition to the family. [It was] in the night. Dr. [Wilford J.] Reichman was our doctor. Dad [my husband] called him and he came. My mother-in-law was there, too. She was not about to 00:47:00let the doctor get away that time. She said, "You are not leaving. You are staying right here." So poor Dr. Reichman sat right there for about three hours until the baby was finally born. [It was] a little girl. He said, "This is a fine, healthy baby. It is two months premature, but she looks just fine." As far as he could tell, there was nothing wrong with her. He even put down on the birth certificate that she was a full-term baby. He had everything all settled down and left. She was born about nine o'clock in the morning.

After he had been gone for a couple hours, we noticed that she was not breathing well. Her breathing did not sound right. We called him back again. He came and examined her and said she would never pull through. [He said that] she would 00:48:00never develop properly. She was blue and her circulation was not working right. She died about seven o'clock in the evening. They did not let me know how bad she was. I thought that everything was fine. I did not feel good about it. Grandma Hiatt was holding her. I said, "She looks cold. Wrap her up." She had already died, but I did not know it. We lost that little baby. She was born on July 23, [1936] and was buried on July 24, [1936]. That has ruined the Twenty Fourth of July for us. [Emotional]

FH:That is one of those sad memories. How many children did you have?

HH:Eleven months after Wynona was born and died, Bruce [Carter Hiatt] came into the family. From then on, we have never had a dull moment! [Laughter]

FH:Was he one of those [who] did not let you rest?

HH:Yes. We love him very much. He has always been a joy to us. After Wynona died, Uncle George Perkel came down to visit mama and he offered dad [my husband] a job on his farm. So we went up there and tried to work for him, but that did not work out. We came back in December of 1936. Bruce was born in June 1937.

[The] winter [of] 1936 and 1937 was a [very] bad winter. We moved down to Bloomington [Washington County, Utah] to take care of some sheep for uncle Archie [McCain]. He was taking care of them for somebody and sublet the job to dad [my husband]. I can remember it snowed. We had never seen snow in St. George like that [winter] and never again since. It snowed so bad we had to haul all our water from St. George. It snowed so bad that we could not cross the [Santa Clara] Creek [River] to come town to get water. We were down there for a long while. All the water we had we [received from] melted snow. [We used it] to wash 00:51:00[clothes] with and [used it] for all our water. We never thought we would have a winter like that in St. George. It was so bad that the pipes froze in [the houses in] town. The water pipes froze and we really had a lot of problems that winter. Dad [my husband] could probably tell you some stories about that that I do not know.

We moved back here in March and stayed with my folks until May [1937]. Then we found a little apartment [in] town. We did not even have enough money to have the electricity turned on. It was a little two-room house and [the landlady] charged us $5.00 a month [for] rent. We had to use a coal oil lamp for light. The night Bruce was born, Dr. A. W. [Alpine Watson McGregor] was out-of-town, so 00:52:00his brother, [Dr.] L. W. [Lorenzo Watson McGregor], came over and delivered Bruce. We lived right across the street from the old [Dixie Pioneer Memorial] Hospital. I had one baby delivered by lamplight. [Laughter] He was healthy and strong. We never had any problems with him.

Lynn [Dee Hiatt] was born a year and a half later in December of 1938. That was another one of our less dull moments. He came into our family and it was even less dull than it had been before. [Laughter] He was quite a baby. He walked when he was ten months old. He walked the earliest of any of them.

Two years later, [on] January 18, 1941, Ralph [Duane Hiatt] was born. Those years were kind of uneventful.

In December, before Ralph was born, Lynn had pneumonia. He was very sick and we were told later that we just about lost him. He pulled out of it, but after he [was] over [it], he had convulsions. Every time that he would run, get overly 00:54:00tired, would laugh too hard, or fall down and get hurt and cry, he would have a convulsion. He did that until he was between four and five years old [when] he got over having the convulsions. I think back now and I should have been absolutely terrified, [but then] it seemed like a part of life. I had to watch him and if he had [a convulsion] I would hold him until he relaxed. Then I would put him on the bed and let him sleep it off. In those days, we did not run to the doctor with everything. We had to figure [things] out for ourselves. We could not afford to go to the doctor.

FH:A lot of times you are just as well off.

HH:[It] seemed like they all grew up. [Laughter] Ralph was another joy in our 00:55:00family. In 1941 we were [in World] War [II]. [The attack on] Pearl Harbor was in December 1941.

In 1942, things had closed down in St. George. Dad [my husband] had started working for Mel Cox at the Arrowhead [Department and] Appliance Store. He would go all over Washington County and down to Moapa and Mesquite [in Nevada]. He would deliver refrigerators and stoves.

Their business closed down during the war so they hardly had anything [to do]. They all went to [Las] Vegas and went to work at the [Basic] Magnesium, [Inc.] plant out at Henderson, [Nevada]. He [Edwin] worked down there all one summer 00:56:00[and] came home on weekends. He [found] a house for us and we moved down there. We lived there for about a year and a half. While we were there, we [had] another little bundle of joy. "Jim" [Reed Hiatt was born in Henderson]. He was the biggest [baby] of the whole bunch. He weighed ten pounds and five ounces when he was born. He has kept up his record ever since.

Then we moved back home [to St. George]. We had saved [our] money while we were down there so we were able to finish our house [in St. George]. We had started building our house [before we were in Las Vegas]. We had half the roof on when Ralph was born. We saved money so we could come home and put windows in, finish the floor and fix it so we could live in it. All these years we had lived in a 00:57:00house [that didn't have] a bathroom. We had a little [outhouse] out in back. We got by [and] that was fine.

I remember bathing all the [children]. I would start with the [youngest] and put him in the tub and bathe him. Then I would go right on [down the line]. Poor Jerry! He always [had] the dirty bath. [Laughter] [It] takes quite a lot of work to haul a tub of water outside and back in for each one of them to have a tub of water.

FH:How many [children] were there all together?

HH:[By now] we had five boys. Then "Johnny" [John Steven Hiatt] joined us. [He was] our April Fool boy. They took his mother [me] to the hospital on April Fool's Day and let us stay home four days before we went back. We kid him about 00:58:00that. [John Steven Hiatt was born April 4, 1946.]

Seventeen months later, we had another little girl [LaDene Hiatt]. We were so tickled. After dad [my husband] left me at the hospital and came home, he went around and woke up all the folks and relatives and told them we had a girl. The next morning he told the boys they had a little sister and they did not believe him. He had told them too many times before that they had a sister and it really was not [a sister]. So they did not believe him at all. Jerry was old enough to come to the hospital to see us. He looked at the baby through the glass and said, "Mom, I just know it is a little girl. It looks like a little girl." We have enjoyed our daughter and spoiled her quite a bit. I think some of the boys, particularly "Johnny", have been jealous of her. They were close to the same 00:59:00age. We probably paid too much attention to her, but we loved all of them the same. [There were] none of them any different.

[TAPE RECORDER TURNED OFF]

HH;Let us talk about Jerry first because he is the oldest. He left home and went into the [United States] Navy when he was seventeen [years old]. One of the biggest mistakes we ever made was to sign for him to go in the Navy. It seemed [like] he was not old enough. A boy is not old enough at seventeen years old to go away from home for an experience like that. It caused him a lot of hardships. It caused us a lot of hardships and heartache. When he was nineteen [years old], he met LaJuana [Cox]. He was nineteen [years old] in May [1954]. They were 01:00:00married on LaJuana's birthday on November 10, [1954]. They have had a hard life. He has been away a lot [of the time].

They were married three years before [having] their first little girl. They named her Cynthia after me which made me happy. He was stationed in Long Beach [California] and he brought her home. A month before the baby was born, he was transferred to Hawaii. He was in Hawaii when "Cindy" was born [on November 7, 1957]. When "Cindy" was ten months old, LaJuana took her and went to Hawaii. He 01:01:00[did] not see her until she was ten months old. They were over there until she was about five years [old].

Clayton was born there [on June 30, 1959]. They [Jerry and LaJuana] came home to St. George in time to have David [born on September 30, 1962]. When David was about six weeks old, they went to Corpus Christi, Texas. They stayed there long enough to [have] Lynnae [on September 4, 1964]. Then they went to Charleston, South Carolina. [They] stayed there until he [Jerry] signed up to go to Vietnam. He brought all [of his] family home. He had to go to school and training to get ready to go to Vietnam. He left in March [1966] to go to Vietnam.

Little Eddie was born July [26, 1966]. LaJuana had quite a time trying to take 01:02:00care of these children all by herself while he was gone to sea so much. She had him by cesarean section which is a major operation. Then she had another major operation. [Having] all [of this] with him [Jerry] gone was quite a crush on her. He [came] home in April [1967]. He [had been] over in Vietnam [for] a year. They stayed here until the [children] were out of school. He [had] duty in Long Beach again. He went down and bought a house in Garden Grove [California] and 01:03:00moved the family down there in time for the [children] start school.

In the meantime, LaDene [Hiatt] had moved to San Diego [California]. She called me and said, "Mom, have you heard from Jerry lately?" I said, "No. Why? What is wrong?" She would not say any more. She started talking about something else. Bruce was on the telephone, too. He asked me a few questions. I did not know a darn thing. I thought: there is something funny going on.

Finally, Jerry called me. He said, "LaJuana has had a nervous breakdown." He [took] leave to take care of the family. He would not let me go down and help 01:04:00him. He took care of the [children]. She was in the hospital for over a month. Then I went down and stayed with them for another three weeks until she [was] back on her feet a little bit. That brings us up-to-date about their family.

Bruce fought like the girls did. He dated half the girls in Washington County. In fact, he liked the girls so much that when he was in junior high school, he even took his little brother, "Johnny", to school with him one day. "Johnny" was a cute [boy]. He had great big, long, curled eyelashes. He introduced him as Bruce's little boy. He used to do everything for him and take care of him. He said, "Can I take "Johnny" to school with me today?" I thought that was an odd 01:05:00[request]. He talked me into it. He wanted to take "Johnny" to school with him. I found out later [that] he wanted all the girls to see what a cute little brother he had. [Laughter]

Bruce went in the [United States] Navy when he was eighteen [years old in 1955]. He was going with a girl in St. George. He thought he would marry her for sure. He came home at Christmas time. Bruce is one [who] used to come home every other weekend. He would come home and I would buy him a bus ticket back. He would come home in another couple of weekends. [He went] back and forth. He would spend as much time at home as he could. He called me one night and said, "Mom, I am going to get married." He had been home. I thought it was with this girlfriend. It was 01:06:00about a month after Christmas. He said, "I am going to get married." I said, "You are not either." He said, "I am." I said, "Who to?" He told me, June Snyder. I said, "My word, where did you meet her? How did you decide this so quickly?" He said, "We decided to get married. We are going to get married on February 6 [1959]. Can you come down?" I said, "I guess I will. I would not miss a wedding." I could not talk him out of it. On February 6, he and June were married. I went down to the wedding. [I] rode the bus down and went to the wedding, got on the bus and came back home.

They have three lovely children. They were fortunate to have any children. The first little girl, Rochelle, "Shelley." was born.

[END OF TAPE ONE -- SIDE TWO]

HH:She was in labor twelve hours or twenty-four hours. I cannot remember [how long she was in labor]. He finally had to take her back for a cesarean section. She had to have all the rest of the children by cesarean section. About twenty months later, they [had] Gina. [She] lit up their house a lot.

In about another twenty months, they [had Benton]. Bruce jokes and says, "If they had looked and said it was a girl, I would have said 'Stop, the operation', 'Stop the operation'." [Laughter] But they [had] a little boy and they were so happy. I know how they feel about getting a little boy because they knew they would not have any more children. [They are happy] about the same way we were happy when we [had] LaDene after having lost our other little girl.

Bruce has been very fortunate that he has been able to [stay] in San Diego [California] all these years so he could be with his children. [He did] not have 01:08:00to leave them as much as Jerry has. In March of this year, he left for his year in Vietnam.

[TAPE RECORDER TURNED OFF]

HH:He [Bruce] thought his first assignment would be for a year and a half. He [thought] that in a year and a half, with the extra money, they could get out of debt while he was there. He has always been close to his family and loved his family a lot. The closer it came to the time for him to leave, he knew it was [going to be] hard to be away from them. Finally [he] said, "No, I am signing up for a year. Then if I can take a year and a half when I get over there, then I will sign up again." I talked to June, [his wife], the other day and he [is] 01:09:00talking about signing up for a year and a half. She said, "Nothing doing. These [children] need you back home. A year is enough [time]." So I guess he will be home when his year is up. They have a nice home in San Diego. I hope that when he gets back from Vietnam, he will not have to be away from his family anymore.

FH:Is he making [the Navy] a career?

HH:Yes. Both of them are career [men]. Jerry has another four years [before] retirement. Bruce has six [years before] retirement.

Then [there is] Lynn [Dee Hiatt]. [He is] our livewire. I do not know what I can say about him. [Laughter] He is a good boy. He is the only one in the family [who] went on a [LDS] mission. He was called on a mission to the eastern states. 01:10:00He put in his two years there and did a lot of good.

One of his choicest experiences was working with the Hughes family. He did not baptize them. They had been baptized when he met them. He worked with them, studied with them afterwards and they thought a lot of him. When they were ready to come to the temple, they came to St. George to go through the St. George Temple so that we could go with them. One of the choicest experiences of our lives [was] to have this family come [to St. George]. They had four children. [There were] two boys and two girls. We went with them and saw them sealed in the temple. The joy that they experienced that day [was wonderful]. I hope that the rest of our boys [who] have not been to the temple will be able to [have this] experience.

After chasing girls all over Washington County, he found a sweet little girl 01:11:00just up the street. [She lived a] couple blocks out [from] the street and up the street a block. They were married on May 18, [1962]. [It has been] six years. She [Alice (Jones) Hiatt] has been a wonderful little wife to Lynn.

They have never been able to have any children. That has been the sorrow of their life. They have both worked and done a lot of things, but they have never been quite content to settle down to anything. They have worked jobs and then they have changed [jobs to] something else. They [operated] a 7-Eleven Store in Las Vegas for a year. Then [they] decided they did not like that.

Lynn loves animals and he decided he wanted to be a veterinarian. He had always 01:12:00wanted to be a veterinarian. He always loved animals. I will have to go back and tell a little story about him. When he was about eleven [years old] or twelve [years old], I saw him coming up the street dragging this big, white, furry dog. He was dragging him. The dog had all four feet back. He did not want to come, but Lynn was the boss and made him come. He had a rope around his neck. He came up to the back door and hollered, "Mom." I looked out and he said, "Mom, look at this pretty dog that followed me home from school. Can I keep him?" Before I could say anything, the dog pulled away from him and up the street he went as fast as he could run. [Laughter] He loved animals and he decided that he really 01:13:00wanted to be a veterinarian. So they moved back to Urbana, Illinois so he could go to the University of Illinois to become a veterinarian.

They were fortunate when they got back there; they both [found] jobs that they liked. The job that Lynn [had] was unstable in some ways, so he decided to look around for something else [to do]. They saw an ad in the paper and [he] decided to check on it. It was for house parents in a home for disturbed children. [Inaudible] They were substitute parents for quite awhile [while] they were checked and approved. Finally, they became fulltime house parents in the home. They had six boys between the ages of fourteen [years old] and sixteen [years 01:14:00old]. They really enjoyed this house. When Alice came home to his little sister's wedding, you could tell by her manner how content they seemed to be [and] how happy they were [there]. She told us stories about the different boys and their problems. I think this was an answer to their prayers. They prayed and tried to find a place where they could do some good in the world. That seemed to be the answer to their prayers. I feel that they can do a lot of good there because they both have a lot of faith and love children.

FH:That is wonderful.

HH:It is. They find a lot of satisfaction and joy there. Then [there is] Ralph 01:15:00[Duane]. He is our next boy. Ralph left to go in the [United States] Air Force on May 8 [1959] -- the same day that Lynn left to go on his mission. He had been a week in the mission home. He left to go on his mission back east. [They were] both in Salt Lake [City, Salt Lake County, Utah]. Ralph served his four-year term in the [United States] Air Force. It was nearly time for him to [be discharged when there was the] big fuss in Cuba. Then all [military] time [was] extended. His [time was] extended a year, so he put in five years in the [United States] Air Force. He spent most of the first year in Amarillo, Texas at 01:16:00Lackland Air Force base. He liked it while he was there. When he came home, he was in California at the [March] Air [Reserve] Base by Riverside [California]. He was there two years [and] then [was] transferred to Glasgow, Montana. He was two years there [and] was [discharged] from the Glasgow Air Force [Base].

I guess he thought he did not want to come back to St. George. He never was too happy in St. George. He did not want to come back here to live and work. Jerry was in Corpus Christi at [the] time Ralph was [discharged]. So he decided to go back to Texas. He liked it there. He went to Corpus Christi where Jerry was and 01:17:00[found] a job as a milkman. He worked for Cream O' Weber. On his milk route [which was] way out in the country [and] way over in Robstown [Texas] he saw

[a] nice, pretty girl. He kept going back there and he sold them quite a bit of [milk products]. He sold himself, too! He wound up with a Texas wife. She is a sweet girl. We love her a lot. He called collect [and] said, "Mom, I am going to get married." I said, "My goodness, I never even knew you had a girlfriend." Would I come down to the wedding. So I did. I had to borrow $100.00, but I 01:18:00borrowed it and went to his wedding. They combined it very nicely so I could see a little bit of the Gulf Coast and went to the wedding. Dad had never met Carolyn [(Teschendorf) Hiatt] until last year.

After awhile, he wrote and said, "We are going to have a [baby]. We are going to have a little boy in July [and] name [him] Sammy." So we waited, but they did not [have] a little boy named Sammy. They [had] a little girl named Gail. [When] Gail was about a year and a half old, [which was] about Easter time last year [1967], they came [to Utah].

[The state of] Texas, around Corpus Christi, is as flat as it is mountainous 01:19:00here. Carolyn loved it here [and] had a good time. She liked the trees and the mountains. She even saw some snow. She was so excited that she could hardly stand it. They took pictures and were here with us for a week. They had to go back [home]. This year, we were fortunate during our vacation, to go down and visit them. [We] saw all that flat country. I do not think we like the flat country quite as well as they like the mountains. There was not as much to see there.

Then we went on down to see "Jimmy" [James Reed Hiatt]. He was another one [who] did not let us have a dull moment. He liked the girls, too. He thought all the girls liked him. [Laughter] I guess they did. He tested the girls until he met a 01:20:00girl at Cedar [City, Iron County, Utah] named Karren. She was a cute little girl. He chased her until she caught him. They were married and had a nice [small] wedding in Cedar [City]. They were married on August 9, [1964] [which was] just before Ralph's wedding on September 12, [1964]. We had two weddings in over a month.

They moved to Las Vegas. They have two lovely little children. [There is] little Shelly. We are happy and proud of her. She is a sweet little girl. In fact, we have enjoyed her. We have been able to see her more than we have a lot of the 01:21:00other grandchildren. They [had] a little son on May 7, 1968. I do not know who was the happiest. [I do not know if] he or "Johnny" [were the happiest] when they both [had] their sons just four days apart. We are happy that we are close enough that we can go and visit with them. There will be more to tell about their family later. They are just getting a good start. The older boys have all their families.

"Johnny" did not leave us any dull minutes either. He liked the girls and the girls all liked him. In fact, he liked quite a lot of girls until he met Shelly. I can remember when he brought Shelly home the first time. I was in the 01:22:00backyard. They had all been talking around it. He introduced me to her and I thought: well, another girlfriend. After he [took] her home and we were alone, I said, "Now look, "Johnny", we have enough Shellys in the family already, so do not plan on marrying her." I think that set him off. Anyhow, they went together for awhile. He [had the] rings and then they broke up.

Then on April 14, he said he had a date to take Shelly to a banquet. I thought: why he was taking his heavy coat? That was a little unusual. He had it over his arm. He stood at the door and he said, "Good-bye. See ya!" He is always 01:23:00[kidding] around and I did not pay too much attention. I noticed that there was something different [about him]. He went out and I went to bed. I woke up like I usually do if the [children] are not home. It seems like I realize [when] they are not home and I wake up after awhile. I thought: that boy is not home yet. It was about morning. I jumped out of bed and said, "My word, that [boy] has not been home all night long. His bed is not slept in." Then I thought: Oh, oh. So I looked in his drawer where I knew he had the rings. They were gone. I said to dad [my husband], "Those [two] have run off and married." And they had!

Ralph and Carolyn were still here in April. It was [on a] Saturday. [When] you 01:24:00work all week, you have to get up, wash [clothes], mow the lawn and clean the house no matter what [has] happened. I [was doing the] wash and dad [her husband] was mowing the lawn. Here came Shelly's dad. They missed their daughter about two o'clock and she was not home. They looked and her bed [had not been] slept in either. They threw the bed back to see if she had been in the bed at all. Nobody had been there, but they found a note down inside the bed telling them. "Johnny" did not even bother to leave us a note! Just then, Carolyn came out and she said, "Mom, I found this letter on your bedroom floor." I looked at it and it was his note. He had put it right on top of the bed where we could not help but see it when we went to bed. But, somehow, the covers [blankets were] 01:25:00thrown back and we did not see it.

Anyway, he went to Pocatello, Idaho and [was] married. It made us feel bad. It hurt us to think that they had not let us know [that] they were going to get married. They should have known we would go along with them and let them get married if they wanted to that bad. Shelly was just seventeen [years old] and her parents had told her that they did not want her to get married until she graduated from high school. When they marry, you make the best of it. They have been [very] happy. When it was time for school to start, Shelly enrolled and went ahead and finished her [education]. She went to classes until Christmastime. They were expecting a baby in April, so she did not go to classes anymore, but she did homework and fulfilled all the requirements so she could graduate.

On May 3, [1968] they [had] a little son. They were proud of their baby boy like the rest of us. "Jimmy" [had] his son on May 7, [1958]. That was quite an occasion for us because [we had] two little grandsons. [They were] almost twins. We will probably always call them our twin boys. One has long black hair and the other one was blond and baldheaded. [Laughter] They are still our twin babies.

Shelly graduated from high school. Not too many high school graduates have a little son at [their] graduation exercises. We thought we were going to have one 01:27:00of our sons stay in St. George so we could enjoy their family, [but] what does "Johnny" do? He came in and said, "I am going to quit my job and move to Arizona." So he went off and left us. He came home at least once a month until he was out of [the Utah National] Guard. So that will not be too bad for a little while.

Then there is LaDene [who is] our little girl. We [had] her [after] we lost Wynona. Somehow I never seemed to worry about all the boys. They were all healthy and strong. I seemed to know that they would be alright. I would feed them and put them to bed and get up and take care of them if they cried. If they did not cry and they slept all night, [then] I slept all night, too. [When] we [brought] her home from the hospital, I could not rest at all. Every little 01:28:00while I would get up and go feel her to see if she was still breathing. I could not believe that she would be alright. Finally, I decided she was going to stay with us and she still is [with us].

She was always a quiet child when she was growing up. I enjoyed her. I used to love to curl her hair, make her cute little dresses to wear and take her with me every place I would go. She went to Relief Society with me. Every place I went I took her with me until she graduated from high school. She wanted a job, so I encouraged her to go out to [The] Hawthorne [Company] where I worked to [find] 01:29:00work. She did and worked there for about a year or year and a half.

She wanted to get IBM [International Business Machine] training [for] computer programs. She signed up for school and went back to Kansas City [Kansas] and went to school there for about three months. She came home and could not [find] anything here that she wanted to do. She could not [find] anything in Las Vegas. So she went to San Diego [to live] with Bruce. She still did not get computer training as they did not want to hire unless you had experience.

She worked for Montgomery Ward for a little while and then went to work for the telephone company. She met a boy [who] she liked a lot. He was in [military] 01:30:00service and had to go to the east coast. She liked him a lot. She liked him better than he liked her. She decided she would come home. She did not want to stay [in California] anymore.

She came home and went back to work out [at The] Hawthorne [Company]. She was doing new board wiring and getting some computer experience there. That is the reason that she came back -- to go to work there, so she could get some experience. She wanted to buy a new car and wanted to save her money. She knew it would not cost her anything to live at home. She knew this boy well out at the plant. [She] knew him before when she worked there. She had to invite somebody to an office party, so she asked him to go. They have sort of been going [together] ever since [then]. Today she told me that they had decided to 01:31:00get married next summer. So that is about as much as I can tell about [her] story now. He is a nice boy and we are happy about it.

FH:Is there something that we might have forgotten along the way?

HH:[There may have been something I forgot when we were] talking about working at [The] Hawthorne [Company]. Our family has had a pretty good experience out there. I was working at the hospital [in the] housekeeping [department] and 01:32:00housekeeping at home. I [soon] tired of that.

When [The] Hawthorne [Company] was [starting] the plant, they [had] interviews for employment. I thought that sounded like a good thing. I was interviewed and was accepted for this school. They had a class to learn to use the machines in connection with [Dixie] College. You could get college credit for it. I did not take credit, but I completed school there in April [1963]. [That was] five years ago last April. The class lasted three weeks and the plant opened in June [1963].

I could quit the hospital any time. I just [didn't want] to tell them that I was going to quit. I skittled around and then I decided [what I was going to do]. 01:33:00Jerry was going to come home for deer season in October. I thought: I will wait and tell them and will quit so I will be home while the [boys] are home for deer season. That is what I did. After they left, it seemed to be so good to be home for awhile and not have to get up and go to work at seven o'clock every morning. I stayed home until December [1963]. I thought: no, I have to get my foot in my hand and get back to work or I will sit here the rest of my life. So I went out and told them I was ready to come to work.

I went in the next Monday morning, [which was] on December 9, [1963]. [I] started sewing [tent] floors. I did those floors for five months. I was sick of floors! There was an opening on the round table, so I asked to be transferred. I 01:34:00liked that pretty good. They only had three steam pointers then and they could not keep three round tables busy. So I took a leave of absence and went to Texas [when] Ralph was married.

When I came back home, there was not enough work on the round table, so they put me up on the seamer line. I sewed there until I could make rates. Then there was an opening on the seam corner. So I went there and I really liked that job. I thought: boy, this is it. I am not shifting around anymore. I am staying on this job right here. I was starting to make rates [when] they called me and said that [inaudible] wanted to see me. I went in [to see her]. I thought there was something different, but I went in. They had decided to put on an auxiliary 01:35:00operator. They asked me if I would like it. They explained to me that I would be paid a flat rate. I would not be on rates [or] piecework like the other jobs. I would be on a flat salary. It sounded pretty good, so I took it. If I am on a job where I can do good and I can make extra, I did it, but I [was] paid a flat rate. I really enjoyed that. I have done it now for four years. I have been an auxiliary operator.

It is a challenge to me to go and see how fast I can work up on a job. If I can work on most jobs [for] a couple of days, I can work up to rate. A lot of times I get discouraged and decide I will quit. [But] I [thought]: no, I cannot quit, because if I quit I would not get my good job back. So I cannot quit anymore. I 01:36:00will probably work there.

We are going to remodel our kitchen. It is all bid [out] and we are going to get ready to do it. We are going to get new cabinets and remodel it. [We are going to] put a heating and cooling system in the house. Until now, I know I will work another four years until that is paid for. After that, I do not know [what I will do]. Maybe I will relax and stay home and keep my house clean for awhile.

FH:[Do] you enjoy your work there?

HH:I enjoy my work. [I enjoy] every day. I get upset sometimes, but I do enjoy my work.

FH:You have told what you are planning for the next four years, but what would you like to do in the future?

HH:I think that after we get through working, we will probably spend the rest of 01:37:00our lives [working] in the temple. That is one reason we have stayed in St. George. The [children] have tried to talk us into moving to California. Dad's [my husband's] folks have tried to talk us into moving. After we get older, what in the world would we do down there? Here we are just two and a half blocks from the temple. We can go to the temple and spend the rest of our lives doing [work in the temple]. I think that is where we will end our days.

FH:It is wonderful work. After all this lifetime of good experiences and wonderful family, perhaps you would like to leave some counsel and advice for those who come after you.

HH:I would [like to leave some advice], if they would listen to it. I have tried to talk to the [children] and advise them. We have to learn from our own experiences. One thing that I am thankful for is the unity that we do have in our family. The desire that the boys have to go and visit each other. [They do 01:38:00not get together] too often, but whenever they can, they do enjoy getting together. I think that if they all feel the necessity of the closeness and unity that we have enjoyed in our family and the love that we have for each other. If we could all realize that what we do and what we say every day, every hour and every minute of every day is affecting those around us. [I wish] the boys would realize that they are teaching their children every day by the things that they 01:39:00do. [They are] not [teaching by] what they tell them and what they talk to them about. It is what they do [that] sets an example for them.

Jerry uses tobacco. I do not think he uses it in the house. He did not [use it in the house] while I was there. I tried to talk to him about it. He said, "I am not worried a bit about it, mama. I am teaching Clayton and David not to use tobacco." I said, "Jerry, you are not teaching them not to use tobacco. You are teaching them to use it. Every breath you draw, you are teaching them to use it." He did not believe me. He thinks he talks to them and tells them that it is not good for them. It is not doing [any] good. It is not teaching them a thing. 01:40:00He might as well keep still because, every breath he draws, he is teaching them something different.

[It is] the same with Bruce. [It is] the same with Ralph. [It is] the same with "Jimmy." All those things that you do, keep you from all the good things in life. If you can just realize what you are teaching your children --.

[END OF TAPE TWO -- SIDE ONE]

HH:If I could have realized long ago what things I had done wrong and done [them] differently, [my life], in a lot of respects, would have been different. If my father could have realized what he was missing by using tobacco, maybe it would work with our grandchildren. I do not know. I know that my dad taught me 01:41:00early to hate it. It might not work that way the next time. Caring and loving about other people and doing things for other people [will] bring us more joy and satisfaction in life than anything else.

I would like to bear my testimony of the gospel. I know that it is true. [Emotional] I know that the plan of salvation He has given us by following His 01:42:00counsel and plan are the only things that will give us joy and satisfaction in life. [Emotional] We do not have anything. We have nothing. I know that God lives and He does answer our prayers. [Emotional] If we pray to Him often, He answers [our prayers]. I hope that we can all realize this. I do know that 01:43:00Joseph Smith is a true prophet of God and that David O. McKay communicates with God today. He does and He will still guide us and help us. I know these things with all my heart. [Emotional] I do this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

[END OF TAPE TWO -- SIDE TWO]